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Behold! The Air Spring Nightmare! (2008 Ram 1500 4x4)


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#11 Andy Douglass

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Posted 16 July 2018 - 12:26 AM

Ahh I really hate telling you this but....

 

Six years ago I put a loaded new Hawk on new 2500HD Chevy and drove away without the need for any mods whatsoever. Its been a great handling combo with no issues. I sincerely believe our "light weight" campers deserve a 3/4 ton platform.

 

In your shoes, I would forget the bags and get a new spring pac rated to carry the load.

 

To be clear the truck the camper is going on for now is a 1/2 ton, and the camper will not be on the truck full time. So I went with the option that I thought would allow us to compensate for the camper when needed, and allow normal comfortable ride when the camper was off. Add to that the ability to do some minimal leveling front to back and side to side (2 way compressor controller) while in camp, and I made the decision to go with bags.

 

That truck is my wife's. My 2005 1/2 ton will be replaced in the next couple of years with a 3/4 ton, and the camper will then go to that truck when we go on trips. I would only want to go with heavier springs, or even a 1 ton, if we were having the camper on the truck full time. Most of the day to day driving we both do will be without the camper on Sonoma County roads. Those that who have experienced the "third-world" quality of our roads will understand.


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#12 ardvark

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Posted 16 July 2018 - 06:51 PM

Man, I'll tell you. If its not air bags it will be something else. I not going to do my rant about one of the best loved of manufacturers, but after calling tech support and getting through, and sending pictures, and support talking to engineering, the response I got was not that I was doing anything wrong. It was sometimes you have to "move the gas tank over a little". You're joking right? Move the gas tank on my truck to make your product fit? Now when something doesn't fit I send it packing immediately. I also found if the supplier is slow to respond, Amazon gets me a response pronto.

 

Hate things are this way, by in my opinion, today's manufacturers can't spell quality control let alone practice it.


Edited by ardvark, 16 July 2018 - 06:52 PM.

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#13 kluber

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Posted 16 July 2018 - 09:21 PM

Andy,

 

I have to second Rotti's comments above.  No matter how much we wish our camper + equipment combos were "just a few hundred pounds over" GVWR, reality check (at the weigh station) will prove otherwise.  Our small trucks just don't have the payload capacity to handle it all.

 

The airbags can be helpful, but it doesn't make sense to depend upon them full time for a long time, particularly if you spend time off road.  A problem with an airbag in a remote setting will turn your leafs into frowns and strand you.

 

I've been using RideRites (installed when I got the camper) but have recently bit the bullet, weighed my truck, pulled the leaf springs, and sent them up to Deaver to be rebuilt to carry my actual payload.  I had MIT in El Cajon help me out and couldn't ask for a better shop.

 

It's more work and cost to do the springs, but in the long run, you'll be safer, more comfortable, and more dependable.  

 

Karl


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#14 knoxswift

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Posted 16 July 2018 - 10:00 PM

I don't have a Ram 1500. I have a Tacoma.

I have excellent success with Roadmaster active suspension. With custom springs. I agree with Karl in the post above.
However to extend the cost I first used Roadmaster on stock setup and eventually customized springs but kept the roadmaster because it worked so well.
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#15 kmcintyre

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Posted 16 July 2018 - 11:40 PM

I've been thinking about changing out my springs on my Ram 1500 Outdoorsman as my camper is on full time but can't find any.  All of the springs you can find state they aren't for the Outdoorsman and wonder if it's because it's slightly higher?  I'd keep my airbags on too.


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#16 2tallDA

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Posted 17 July 2018 - 01:32 AM

Ahh I really hate telling you this but....

 

Six years ago I put a loaded new Hawk on new 2500HD Chevy and drove away without the need for any mods whatsoever. Its been a great handling combo with no issues. I sincerely believe our "light weight" campers deserve a 3/4 ton platform.

 

In your shoes, I would forget the bags and get a new spring pac rated to carry the load.

Agreed. The 2008 1500 Rams didn't have the highest load capacity but a custom leaf pack would help.

I've installed two sets of Firestones on two vehicles with no issues. The second set has been replaced with Carli Long travel units.


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#17 Andy Douglass

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Posted 24 July 2018 - 01:22 PM

So the second Ride Rite kit arrived last week, and I was shocked to find that it appeared to be a complete kit with no manufacturing errors or missing parts. In the interest of capping off this boring saga, I present the next and hopefully last chapter in Lovecraftian form:

 

"Can this be true?" I asked myself, my eyes flitting suspiciously from part to part. "Surely there must be a missing nut, a metal void, some rust, or...something?" Try as I might, I could find nothing wrong with the kit. I tried to ignore the Air Lift Wireless Air box in the corner of the carriage house, but a creeping darkness seemed to exude from it like some foul breath from the underworld. I felt my feet begin to take me out of that den of horrors, as though they had a will of their own, a will of pure self-preservation. Only the mind of a mad man could fight that will, the mind of a man mad enough to attempt such dark experiments and machinations under his own roof.

 

I began to lay out the instruments of my madness, muttering to myself in ancient tongues of the insane. "...ah yes, I must have the 1/2" drive 9/16" socket, the deep one, for the regular one will never fit completely over the u-bolt, and of course I must have those cursed metric sockets at hand, particularly the 15 millimeter...but how will I set the stock jounce bolts to proper torque when I know I do not have a 1/2" drive 15 mm socket? Hah! What a silly question to ask oneself when one knows that the torque wrench would never fit in there anyway. What shall I do, you ask? Well of course I will use an SAE box wrench, the closest one I can find to the evil metric size, but I shall pray to the old gods that I don't round those maniacal bolts over any more than they already are after my previous experiments. The ancient texts call for a precise torque to be set, but I shall place faith in our ability to summon the correct torque by sheer will alone. And what of the self-tapping metal screws? Which screws are you referring to? You silly man, I refer to the screws in the Air Lift compressor kit, which you and I have discussed at length. Ah, yes, I remember now. The screws that will mount the compressor and manifold to the frame, the screws that Air Lift neglected to list the pilot hole size for. But I thought we determined the size of the screws from the Air Lift parts list and then located a proper pilot hole size after hours of research in the laboratory? Well we did, but you silly man, already you forget there are two sizes of self-tapping screw and Air Lift, in their plan to spread foul humours across the land in preparation for the coming of Cthulu, only listed the size of one in the parts list. Ah, you remember now, yes, the kit contains four "1/4 14 x 3/4" self tapping screws" as well as two "self tapping screws". Well two unidentified screws will not stop us, now will it? No it will not, we will simply turn our trained eye to the screw and select a proper pilot hole size. What could go wrong?"

 

As I ranted to myself and shot around the workshop, my pile of instruments grew. Finally I was ready to begin, ready to right the cosmic wrongs that had festered for so long, wrongs that had turned our once happy home into a den of madness, paranoia, and suspicion. I threw open the carriage house doors and peered out at the self-powered wagon that squatted in the courtyard of our humble estate. Pure sunlight showered down and a blast of thick fetid air hit me in the face. The light seemed to dissolve out of existence below the wagon, and the dark space there gaped and growled at me like the maw of some ancient beast. I prepared for my descent into darkness, laying out all of my instruments and provisions. As I pulled myself down into the darkness, I swear I heard the laughter of the foul disciples of the Corporatikon all around me. 

 

As I began to work down there in the darkness, my spirits were high. Surely I would conquer the beast this time. Things went well as I installed the air springs. I had to backtrack several times, but unscrewing lock nuts off of long bolts an eighth of a turn at a time was not enough to dampen my spirits. I failed to notice the sun settling near the western horizon, and the darkness growing in the east. That darkness that would envelop me later that evening, that darkness sent from the foul necropolis of Lansing, some 2,549 miles away. 

 

With the installation of the air springs complete, I turned my attention the Air Lift compressor kit. My mouth began speaking in the ancient tongues again. "...so, where shall we put the compressor? Of course we shall mount it inside of the wagon's frame, where it is most protected. There, by the transfer case, I think I see a suitable location. Surely my drill will fit there. Ah, these are the mysterious self tapping screws, the nameless ones. But I have feverishly compared drill bits to them and selected the proper size, haven't I? Yes I have, for it must be that the proper pilot hole size would be the size of the screw's shank, wouldn't it? Of course it would, what else could it be?" 

 

I proceeded with my mad plan, my hands working feverishly, as though they had a mind of their own. The sky dimmed above and the darkness from the east loomed. As I turned the screw with a nut driver, a sickening crunch shattered the silence and fragments of brittle metal showered down upon me. The screw had broken. "I shall not worry," I told myself. "For this compressor is mounted with four bolts, and three will be enough for now, I will simply replace the fourth screw at a later date. But now I know that I selected the wrong drill bit." 

 

I dragged myself out of The Maw and replaced my drill bit with one a size larger. As I steeled myself for one last descent into The Maw, I noticed the darkness. It squirmed in the air all around me, writhing serpentinely, and a sense of dread crawled up my spine. "Where has the time gone? Wife? Oh wife, I beg of you, please assist me, as I am now unsure that I can complete this afore my time expires. Where are you? I know that you are here somewhere. You must help me! Oh, there you are!"

 

My poor wife emerged reluctantly from the carriage house. Looking back now, I know that she saw more clearly than I. She did not ignore the foul omens like I had chosen to do. But she elected to assist me despite that, bless her sweet soul. I set her to work routing the air lines while I forged ahead with the compressor. I drilled larger holes for the screws. and blessedly that worked. I moved on to mounting the manifold. But where would I put it? I now saw that the spot next to the compressor would never work, for my drill would not fit there. Feverishly I looked around for a spot, holding the manifold up here, pushing it up there. Finally, I located a place suitable. A place that my drill could reach, although at a slight angle. What harm could that do? None, I thought, for I believed myself to be destined to finish the project shortly. I set to work drilling the first pilot hole, my drill at a reckless, haphazard angle. Immediately, that sickening but familiar crunch cracked through the air as I felt the drill bit give way. In my mind, a doorway slammed open and the madness and darkness rushed in. I heard long-extinct beings call to me and sparks of red and black showered from my eyes. The door of sanity rattled on its hinges and began to splinter. 

 

My wife found me cowering in the corner of the carriage house some time later. I must have fled The Maw and shut the carriage house doors, although I do not remember this. I remember the grasp of the Ancient Ones, reaching from out of space and of time, and to this day, that feeling, that sickening, foul feeling still occurs on occasion. I know that I might succumb to it one day, but for now I must ignore it, and pretend that this dark chapter of my life never occurred. My wife and I do not speak of this time.

 

So, what happened then, you ask? Well, the Ancient Ones must have lost interest, for they allowed us to overcome our tribulations without further incident. I went to work the next day, trying not to think of the transpirations of the previous evening. My wife borrowed her mother's carriage and journeyed to the Lowe's Mercantile, where she purchased a "right-angle" drill. Have you heard of such a thing? It is a miracle, it functions exactly as a regular drill, but the majority of the mechanism is in the handle, allowing for holes to be drilled in small spaces. That evening, after returning home from work, my wife and I set to finishing my foul experiment. It is true that we did not finish until midnight, but thankfully we were unmolested by further tribulations of any note. The darkness had left me, and to this day, it has not returned. I am a practical man, though, and I have come to observe a sense of dread about me. It is not great, but it is there, a whisper of dread, a thin veil of fear. Fear of what might transpire, should any of that cursed equipment fail. For I cannot be sure that the dark madness will not come flooding back in, shattering the door of sanity forever. Until then...


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#18 wuck

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Posted 05 August 2018 - 04:13 AM

Most of the day to day driving we both do will be without the camper on Sonoma County roads. Those that who have experienced the "third-world" quality of our roads will understand.

 

Yeah, there's a bump in the road around the corner, big redwood root under it (Why did the redwood cross the road?). I think someone in the neighborhood put some sticky yellow tape and a reflector on top of it. Everybody swings around it rather than going over it.

 

Finally, the county got around to fix it.

 

They added some asphalt ramps on both sides of the root. Thank You, Sonoma County.

 

 


So the second Ride Rite kit arrived last week, and I was shocked to find that it appeared to be a complete kit with no manufacturing errors or missing parts. In the interest of capping off this boring saga, I present the next and hopefully last chapter in Lovecraftian form:

 

"Can this be true?" I asked myself, my eyes flitting suspiciously from part to part. "Surely there must be a missing nut, a metal void, some rust, or...something?"

 

[Snippity . . . snip]

 

For I cannot be sure that the dark madness will not come flooding back in, shattering the door of sanity forever. Until then...

 

Nice, but you know, pics?, or it didn't happen  ;)


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#19 CougarCouple

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Posted 16 August 2018 - 01:16 AM

Hi Andy
Got my Hellwig kit installed. How you liking your air springs. I also had to slightly modify one lower axle clamp so I did not have to bend the heck out of the brake line. IMG_1133.JPG

Really glad I got some. Truck is riding level gvwr 10,000 actual weight 9140 loaded across the scales. Rides nice slightly different than with out. 15psi


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#20 Andy Douglass

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Posted 18 August 2018 - 07:00 AM

We did around 800 miles on the setup with the camper fully loaded. Since we never drove the camper without the sway bar, its hard to say if that made a difference, but between the sway bar and the air springs, the ride was surprisingly easy on our 1/2 ton. It was a little "floaty" but we got used to it and had no trouble doing 60-70 mph (we drove up Hwy 101 from Sonoma County to SW Oregon, which has quite a variety of slopes and curves).

 

I was a little nervous, and will continue to be so, about an air spring failure as there is no easy fix on the road. That's why I was so disappointed that the Air Lift Ultimate kit didn't work, because it has an internal jounce bumper whereas the Firestones are just air bags. I put together an air line repair kit for the truck, but if one of the bags fails....AAA plus. Which reminds me, I think I need to keep at least one of the truck's stock jounce bumpers IN the truck, so at least there is an option available without having to order parts out in the middle of nowhere.

 

Need to do a little soapy water test on all the air lines. The Wireless Air compressor kit seemed to behave strangely to me, frequently inflating and deflating the springs. I would expect some adjustment occasionally with big temperature swings, but it being a coastal trip, it was moderate temps the whole way. I can see how a slow leak would account for the frequent inflations, but it doesn't explain the frequent deflation adjustments. And then I started hearing the manifold simultaneously deflating and inflating. The manifold constantly monitors both air springs and maintains the pressure in each one separately, so I can understand how I could hear both inflation and deflation at the same time if it was airing up one side and deflating the other, but the damn thing was going off about every 20 minutes sometimes, again with minimal to no shift in ambient temperature. Fully loaded, I had the driver's side air spring at 50 and the passenger at 40 (max is 100). Pre-camper, we were running them at 5 PSI. So there was a lot of pressure on the system, but well within the specs, and the compressor would only kick on for a second, so well below the 9% duty cycle. The thing I dislike most about the compressor setup is the noise. Several times in camp we would have the truck windows down, and then when going to bed and closing up, we would turn on the truck to roll them up, and you have about 3 seconds after turning the key before that loud compressor goes off. I HATE making unnecessary noise in campgrounds, especially at night.

 

One of the things I was glad for was having E-rated tires (BFG AT Ko2). We normally run them at 35 PSI, but when the camper was all loaded, the rears looked a pretty lazy, with the driver's side more so (more camper weight on that side, the fridge was loaded and all the appliances are over there). I think I pumped the rears up to 70 and 65, and both fronts up to 50. The max PSI on these tires is 80. Between my wife and I, I think we have had about 8 sets of BFG ATs over the years, they seem to be a good balance of asphalt longevity and decent dirt performance, and they handled this pressure test really well. I didn't research best practices or anything, just went off what the tire says on it and pumped them up until they looked normal.

 

Overall, we were surprised at how well the 1/2 ton did. The HEMI was a little laggy up steep grades, but overall the truck performance was great. The truck's comp told us we were getting just over 12 mpg compared to normal 14, but I didn't do any math to verify the accuracy. Next truck will definitely be a 3/4 ton though.


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