17 replies to this topic

[craig333]

Interesting battery. Yeah, if I can't keep my batteries warm I can't keep myself warm and thats not going to happen! 

[JaSAn]

I'm not going to keep the heat on while I am out hunting, ice fishing, showshoeing, or skiing.  Plus my batteries are in the furthest corner of my camper, one of the last places that will be heated.  And I turn the heat way down when sleeping, so not a lot of heat penetration to the battery box.

 

Lithium holds heat well (3.58 kJ/kg Kº) so it takes a while to cool off, but also a lot of energy to heat it back up again. 3 to 6 hours of heat vs. 18 - 22 hrs of cold don't cut it.

[smlobx]

For us we don’t plan on any cold camping (we like to follow the sun).
The ability to charge fast and to virtually 100% allowed us to reduce the battery weight by over 50% which is nice.

[oldhotrod]

Me too, just spent 4 days with highs over 100deg. (112 one day). 160wt overland solar flex panel and 50ahr battle born battery kept my 50qt cooler cool with no issues...battery weights 20lb and is the size of a 6pk of soda cans. I didn't use the interior lights much and don't have a roof fan but will be adding. Still impressed how well it all worked for my needs which are minimal

[wolfmansbro]

Will’s YouTube videos are super helpful. They really helped out with my discussion to eventually switch to Lithium.

The way I see it having a constant 12v supply from 100% to 0% without worrying about damaging the battery is worth it.
I currently have a 80AH AGM (inadequate power for my needs) but at 80AH AGM you only get say 40ah of use?

For those of you that are worried about charging the battery in the cold, are you trying to charge via solar?
My plan is to charge the battery via alternator in the winter (I drive daily to the TrailHeads vs Boondock for multiple days in a row). So the cold isn’t an issue. Plus if the battery gets cold just pull it out and stick it in the cab of the vehicle to warm it up. Could a cheap engine block heater built into a battery Box take care of that issue?

[Scott_H]

There a few misconceptions.  I have all three types of batteries between a horse trailer, travel trailer, and truck camper.  The flooded lead acid batteries have the cheapest initial cost but over time they're not a great investment.  The AGMs are much better, but the Lithium are the best.  The only negative is that the Lithium have a higher initial costs, anywhere from 2 to 5 times the cost, but they can last 10 to 20 times longer than the really cheap batteries and 5 to 10 times longer than the higher in AGM batteries.  They are rated to be 3000 to 5000 cycles and some manufacturers offer very long warranties.  If you have a good working system, I would suggest upgrading to Lithium, until you're ready to replace items in your current system.  These are the advantages of a Lithium system:

 

--Performs down to 0 degrees F better than other batteries.  (All batteries degrade in cold temps, but Lithium perform at a higher voltage.  It's true you can't charge below freezing (28 for Battleborns), but it easy to keep Lithium batteries warm.

--You can have Lithium batteries in the living quarters getting heat.  They don't off gas while charging or discharging.  So they can perform at a desirable consistent room temp when other batteries are exposed to the elements. 

--Lithiums are half the weight so you can easily remove them when not in use.  For some systems like in my TC, I can use one lithium battery at 35lbs and to get the same usable amp hours I would need two AGM batteries at 140 lbs.  Saving a 100lbs can be very desirable as many are near max weight on their trucks.

--Lithiums accept a partial charge without degradation, other batteries begin to suffer if they don't get full charges each time, which is the case in periods of bad weather.  You may also decide that you don't need as much solar panel if you know you don't need a full charge each day.  In my truck camper, can go well over 3 days and only use 30% of my battery and that's running heat all night, fans, and LED lights.  I can charge my battery in 3 hours of driving with a DC to DC charger, so I've decided to delay getting solar at this point.  When I get a fridge, I'll re evaluate at that point. Lithiums are charge quicker which has similar benefits in that you don't need as much good weather for solar.

-- Lithiums can discharge all the way to 90 or 100% without degradation (aka DoD, depth of discharge), so you may need fewer batteries to get same usageable amp hours which obviously saves on costs, but you don't have to worry about damaging the batteries if you go too low.

--When storing lithiums, you don't need a trickle charger as they don't need to float and they are fine with full discharges.  Lots of batteries get damaged beyond repair while in storage.

--When lithiums discharge, they maintain a higher more constant voltage.  This is good for gear that relies on the clean power, like some of the newer compressor fridges and laptops, camera batteries etc.

 

If you can find away to make the initial investment and will keep your rig over time, it will pay for itself several times over.  When making the investment, you typically need to upgrade to a lithium compatible converter/charger and you may want some beefier cables coming of the batteries.  Essentially you should look at the overall cost of ownership, not just the initial purchase.  It's also nice to have a good battery monitor so you can evaluate the performance.  This a good idea for all types of batteries, but if you see an issue you can address with the manufacturer.

[ckent323]

I am curious if there are any folks out there who have used FireFly carbon Foam batteries.

 

These batteries are used on boats because they are reliable and can tolerate (without damage like normal batteries) being used repeatedly without fully recharging.  They support deeper discharge than AGM and they do not have the cold temperature charging issue of LiFePO4.

The price of Firefly batteries seems to be between high quality deep cycle AGM batteries and LiFePO4 batteries.

 

Here are a couple of useful video introductions:

 

 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIVS0WD7Xq8

 

 

Edited by ckent323, 31 October 2019 - 07:12 PM.

[Happyjax]

Very interesting battery......