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Power Stop Brakes


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#1 Cpt Davenport

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Posted 10 June 2022 - 03:04 PM

Anyone have experience with upgrading their brakes with the Power Stop kit?


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#2 JHanson

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Posted 11 June 2022 - 12:05 AM

What does the kit you're looking at include? Unless it incorporates larger diameter or wider or heavier discs (i.e. with more center vanes)  it's unlikely it will hugely improve your stopping and/or resistance to fade. I think I've linked to this article before but it's worth doing again. Just upgrading pads and brake fluid (from DOT 3 to DOT 4 or 5.1) can accomplish a lot.


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#3 Cpt Davenport

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Posted 11 June 2022 - 03:51 AM

What does the kit you're looking at include? Unless it incorporates larger diameter or wider or heavier discs (i.e. with more center vanes)  it's unlikely it will hugely improve your stopping and/or resistance to fade. I think I've linked to this article before but it's worth doing again. Just upgrading pads and brake fluid (from DOT 3 to DOT 4 or 5.1) can accomplish a lot.

 

 

https://www.amazon.c...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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#4 Cpt Davenport

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Posted 13 June 2022 - 03:57 PM

Based on the response in a similar post, so far the consensus of slotted/drilled rotors is claimed to be BS and the only benefit is to the seller through marketing. I have read JHanson's article but also multiple articles supporting the benefits of these and similar aftermarket rotors. 

 

There are hundreds upon hundreds of excellent reviews and results using the Power Stop products. Are this many people paid off to post false reviews for the last 35 years?

 

Perhaps it is the thicker Carbon fiber-ceramic compound used in the Power Stop pads that is offering smoother, quicker stops and longer life?

 

I would still like to hear from anyone who has personal experience with this product on a hauling/towing vehicle.

I find there are usually 3 sides to every story when solely based on internet research. 

  1. That of the supporter
  2. That of the hater
  3. That of the truth which rests somewhere in the middle.

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#5 JHanson

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Posted 13 June 2022 - 05:08 PM

You seem to have lumped me in among the "haters," which is simply wrong. It was my determination to uncover the truth that led to a several-week-long investigation of aftermarket brake systems, including phone calls with several engineers. None of those engineers—not one—was a proponent of cross-drilled discs. Sure, you can line up a bunch of people who will say otherwise—most of whom are either selling "upgrade" kits or have spent a chunk of change on "upgrade" kits that included drilled discs. Many of the latter might indeed be experiencing better performance with the kit they bought—but it won't be due to the cross-drilled discs in the kit. The only benefit to cross-drilled discs, according to those engineers with whom I spoke, is a slightly better initial bite in wet conditions. But even that is transitory as the pads quickly squeegee off water. Otherwise those holes simply reduce the mass of the disc, which reduces its ability to absorb and transfer heat, thus reducing, not enhancing, its performance.

 

I found exactly one independent test that showed superior performance from cross-drilled discs—and even that article mentioned nothing about the supposed cooling effect. I saved the article as research material, but it was an outlier.

 

As I mentioned in the article, the simplest and cheapest way to "upgrade" stock brakes is with a premium set of pads (more resistant to glazing) and high-temperature brake fluid (more resistant to boiling). Otherwise you should be looking for a kit that incorporates larger diameter or wider discs, or discs with more vent slots in the center (making them heavier than stock).


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#6 Cpt Davenport

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Posted 13 June 2022 - 08:14 PM

All I'm looking for is to increase my breaking power how ever I can. I'm not by any means hung up on the slotted/drilled issue. I do respect reviews of those with first hand experience and have had great success with other upgrades using those reviews as my compass. If the Power Stops provide me with enhanced braking, that is all I'm after regardless of how that is accomplished. I have ordered the full kit, and now I think, based on this discussion, I will also order some high quality pads separately. My local 4wd shop is owned by a my good friend with over 30 years of experience with pushing trucks to their limits. If he says forget the rotors and just go with better pads, then that is what we shall do. I have a call into him as to which pads he would recommend. 

 

I love the idea here of Dot 4 fluid, thanks for that. Any suggestions on a great pad manufacture?

 

Just doing the pads only would be an awesome savings of around $400 just in parts not to mention the cost in labor savings.


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#7 JHanson

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Posted 13 June 2022 - 11:00 PM

I'm not current enough on pads to offer proper advice. There are a lot of new variations coming out! 

 

I'd be very interested to hear more when you've made your modifications and tried them.


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#8 ntsqd

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Posted 14 June 2022 - 01:34 PM

The problem with drilled rotors is that they are crack initiators. Think about what is going on there. A rotor is where the kinetic energy of the vehicle is converted into heat, they get hot. Sometimes really, really hot. I've seen race cars with them glowing orange-red! I doubt many street vehicles get them that hot, but you get my point.

 

When they get hot the metal expands. Those holes are discontinuities that cause unequal thermal expansion which results in internal stress in the metal of the rotor. That stress is the greatest around those holes, and will eventually crack the rotor starting at those holes. Having been involved in racing and in the design of disc brake systems some time ago I can't say that I've ever seen a drilled rotor that did not have cracks in it excepting those that were still in the box.

 

Why were those holes were first drilled in early racing rotors? The early pad compounds tended to out-gas when they got hot. This resulted in a layer of gas between the pad and the rotor. The holes were drilled as a way to get that layer out from between the pad and the rotor. Pads that did this haven't been made for over 40 years, but people see holes in old race car rotors and assume that they are a good thing. No marketing person worth their pay would pass up that opportunity to sell more rotors. That they crack prematurely just means more rotor sales than ever.

 

There is no way that I would ever put drilled rotors on my vehicles. Not just no, but hell no!

I'm not up on current pad compounds either, but those can only do so much and then if you need more then you're at the point where JHanson's advice of bigger diameter rotors is your next step.

A simple Rule of Thumb for brake rotors: Larger OD = Increased Brake Torque; Increased thickness = Better fade resistance. Those are more intermingled than that, but the RoT is a good basic guide.


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Thom

Where does that road go?

#9 JHanson

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Posted 14 June 2022 - 04:04 PM

 

 

 

A simple Rule of Thumb for brake rotors: Larger OD = Increased Brake Torque; Increased thickness = Better fade resistance. Those are more intermingled than that, but the RoT is a good basic guide.

 

Thom, that is an excellent rule of thumb; I never thought of it that way.


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#10 ntsqd

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Posted 14 June 2022 - 05:12 PM

Glad that it helps. :)


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Thom

Where does that road go?




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