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Water Pump 2017 Hawk


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#1 BryanToyFWC

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Posted 05 April 2023 - 04:23 PM

Hello!  This forum has proved so valuable.  I need a little more help with my water pump.  Original to the 2017 camper.  Normally when my water tank is full and I flip the switch to turn on the water pump, you hear the pump start and charge the system.  When the system is charged the pump stops and only turns on when I use the sink faucet.  Currently the water pump does not stop and just keeps going and going.  The faucet still works.  I have detected no leaks despite trying hard to find one.  

 

I just took the camper on a pretty epic White Rim adventure and simply had to use the pump switch to run water vs the faucet.  We did not lose any water through the 4 days.  

 

Is this just a bad pump that needs swapping, or do I need to consider other issues?

 

Thanks!!!

 

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#2 Chuck H.

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Posted 05 April 2023 - 04:53 PM

Is your bottom valve below the water pump shut off?  If not, faucet can be off but water will cycle through the open valve back into the storage tank.  Worth checking.


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#3 Vic Harder

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Posted 05 April 2023 - 05:54 PM

The pump pressure and resting pressure can be adjusted... 

Shurflo 4008 Water Pump Needs Adjustment - YouTube


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#4 AdventureDave

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Posted 10 April 2023 - 04:38 PM

You probably just have an air pocket.  It happens to me when I let the tank run dry.  After refilling the tank I may experience the problem you're having.  I haven't researched a proper priming procedure I've just been opening sink faucets and/or the outdoor shower faucet to try and purge the air pocket until the pump stops cycling.  I have a hot water heater and I think this makes priming harder also.


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#5 New Man

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Posted 13 April 2023 - 06:35 PM

For BryanToyFWC's original issue, I echo Vic Harder's reply: Check out the Shur-Flo manual to adjust the pump resting pressure (i.e., so that the pump stops running when the faucet is closed). If water will flow through the faucet and there are no leaks, the pump itself is primed and fine, and just needs adjustment. I am rather ignorant of such things, but I believe there is a solenoid switch that is triggered by backpressure to shut the pump down when the faucet is closed, and if the screw that adjusts that solenoid isn't adjusted right, the pump keeps grinding away even when the faucet is closed.

 

Different but somewhat related problem: multiple times I've had trouble getting my pump to prime after I've emptied my tank, waterlines, and pump to winterize. In this case, of course, the pump grinds away but no water flows. I've found this works: Remove the filter on the pump (clear plastic cylinder next to the inlet on the pump [check that the filter is clean while you are at it]), squirt some water into the pump body [a pain in the b_tt]), fill the filter housing with water and re-install it. Sometimes I've had to do this a couple of times, so if anyone knows an easier way to prime these pumps I'd love to hear it.

 

Yet another different but somewhat related problem: Once I did everything stated in the previous paragraph. The pump ran on and on, but would not prime after two or three attempts to prime it. Finally I pulled the pump, took the housing off the top [eight screws], and found that the O-ring on the piston was a bit tweaked (probably by ice the previous winter). Fortunately it wasn't broken [I was in the middle of nowhere], so when I put the O-ring back in its groove on the piston and re-installed the pump it worked like a charm. Just a couple of hours gone when I would have rather been staring at rocks and trees...

 

I know the previous is TMI for the old timers and folks that know how to fix stuff, but nowadays FWC is selling a lot of campers to people that barely know the difference between a monkey wrench and and an allen wrench, and I gotta say owning one of these contraptions is an education!

 

Happy camping!


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#6 Vic Harder

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Posted 14 April 2023 - 05:10 PM

Great and informative post New Man!  

I've never had the priming issues you mention.  Your workarounds seem logical, given my experience with other pumps.  I wonder if adjusting your pump might not solve this issue too?  

 

There are two adjustments 1) Max Pressure and 2) Restart Pressure (my terms).  I discovered this when I added a super high quality water filter to our camper.  The filter restricted flow enough that it was now just a trickle coming out of the tap.  I was going to buy a different water pump to compensate, and then figured out that I could adjust the pressure on my existing pump.  I did that, and then had to adjust the "restart" pressure too so that it would run until max pressure was reached and not instantly restart when I turned on the tap, but wait a few moments instead.  It took me a while of playing around with the settings to get it to run well.  I keep the right sized allen key in a drawer in the camper in case it needs adjusting, but so far so good since I dialed it in last year.


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#7 Wandering Sagebrush

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Posted 14 April 2023 - 09:48 PM



<snip>

Different but somewhat related problem: multiple times I've had trouble getting my pump to prime after I've emptied my tank, waterlines, and pump to winterize. In this case, of course, the pump grinds away but no water flows. I've found this works: Remove the filter on the pump (clear plastic cylinder next to the inlet on the pump [check that the filter is clean while you are at it]), squirt some water into the pump body [a pain in the b_tt]), fill the filter housing with water and re-install it. Sometimes I've had to do this a couple of times, so if anyone knows an easier way to prime these pumps I'd love to hear it.

 

Yet another different but somewhat related problem: Once I did everything stated in the previous paragraph. The pump ran on and on, but would not prime after two or three attempts to prime it. Finally I pulled the pump, took the housing off the top [eight screws], and found that the O-ring on the piston was a bit tweaked (probably by ice the previous winter). Fortunately it wasn't broken [I was in the middle of nowhere], so when I put the O-ring back in its groove on the piston and re-installed the pump it worked like a charm. Just a couple of hours gone when I would have rather been staring at rocks and trees...

 

<snip>

The only times I’ve had priming issues was when all faucets were closed, once a faucet was opened, it primed without problem.  I suspect the pump was compressing air in the lines which didn’t allow the pressure to build enough pressure to trigger sensing switch.  YMMV


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I am haunted by waters


#8 New Man

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Posted 16 April 2023 - 10:12 PM

I went back and studied my Pentair "SHURFLO 4008 RV Revolution By-Pass Pump Installation & Operation Manual" p. 2 [who'da thunk to do that?]. It appears BryanToyFWC's original problem [THE PUMP WILL NOT SHUT OFF] and its fix is described there (as Vic Harder suggested):

 

"ABOUT THE BY-PASS

NOTE: By-pass adjustment should only be performed by a professional technician with proper gauges and equipment.

The by-pass is a spring loaded diaphragm that opens up allowing water from the discharge side back to the inlet side. The by-pass is set to begin opening at about 40 psi and creating full by-pass at about 62 psi (lower pressure pumps will vary depending on the by-pass and pressure shut-off settings). The pressure switch on the pump is set to shut off at 55 psi. If the switch or by-pass are adjusted too much, the by-pass and switch shut-off can overlap and THE PUMP WILL NOT SHUT OFF. Screwing the switch screw in clockwise will raise the shut-off pressure. Unscrewing the switch screw counterclockwise will lower the pump shut-off pressure. Screwing the by-pass screw in will raise the pressure at which the by-pass starts and raise the full by-pass pressure. Unscrewing the by-pass screw counterclockwise will lower the pressure at which by-pass starts and lower the full by-pass pressure.

WARNING: If full by-pass is reached before the shut-off setting, the pump will not shut off. Full by-pass pressure setting should be at least 10 psi higher than pump shut off pressure."

 

Also, p. 3:

 

"PUMP WILL NOT SHUT-OFF / RUNS WHEN FAUCET IS CLOSED

√ Output side (pressure) plumbing for leaks, and inspect for leaky valves or toilet.

√ For air trapped in outlet side (water heater) or pump head.

√ For correct voltage to pump (±10%). √ For loose drive assembly or pump

head screws.
√ Are the valves held open by debris

or is the rubber swollen?
√ Pressure switch operation. By-pass

set higher than shut-off."

 

 

Of course the manufacturer says to have the by-pass adjustment done by "a professional technician," but I'm guessing if one can decipher the manual and is careful one can pull it off without breaking one's water lines / frying the pump (see Vic Harder's post above). It strikes me as odd that a properly functioning pump could get "un-adjusted," but maybe bouncing around on really rough tracks can do it.

 

On my priming issue, it comes and goes. Note that I have the simplest of setups, just tank, pump, faucet [no water heater, shower, etc.]. Sometimes I fill the tank, turn on the pump [with the faucet open] and no problem. Other times the pump grinds on and on and won't prime. I have the notion that this occurs when I've done a super good job of winterizing so that there is no water to make an adequate seal around the O-ring on the piston in the pump. Then when I squirt water into the pump inlet and fill the filter housing it creates a vacuum seal that enables the pump to draw water up from the tank. Maybe.

 

I note FWC mentions priming as a possible issue in its helpful "Water Pump & Water System: Filling, Priming, Troublesooting Tips & Tricks" PDF:

 

"If you have not solved the problem yet, next try re-establishing a prime inside the water pump by somehow refilling the water line from the water pump, to the water tank, with water. Connect the water line again to the water pump and turn the pump back on to see if the water begins to move toward the faucets. This could take 10 or 20 seconds. Be sure the faucets are fully open (especially the cold water faucet) and watch to see if water starts coming out of the sink. Anything?"

 

For what it is worth, having fiddled around with my pump way more than I ever thought I would, I have the impression that these thing are pretty tough and rather simple devices, and not that hard to fix. If you've read this far, don't give up!

 

 


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#9 BryanToyFWC

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Posted 21 April 2023 - 01:24 AM

Thank you so much everyone!!  I had to take the camper off the truck for some truck stuff, but will be back on soon and will start working through these solutions!  I'll let you know what works.  Thanks!!


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#10 BryanToyFWC

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Posted 24 April 2024 - 04:16 PM

I thought I had this issue solved last year, but has now resurfaced.  I suspect an air pocket vs pump bypass adjustment as the issue resolved itself after a couple camping adventures.  Camper was winterized/drained, and now back on the truck and the pump is endlessly running with the faucet on/off.  Ugh.  I had the hex key handy on our last adventure and played with the two adjustments per the instructions in one of the things above in an attempt to reset the pressures at both adjustments.  No avail.  Played with the adjustments as the pump ran, still no help.  So maybe it is an air pocket or loose gasket somewhere in the pump?  No leaks anywhere.  Any hints at resolving air pockets other than just running the system continuously?  

At this point I've been temped to just buy another pump as they aren't all that pricey, but suppose if it's some trapped air somewhere that wouldn't solve the issue......


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