Water Pump 2017 Hawk

BryanToyFWC

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Denver
Hello! This forum has proved so valuable. I need a little more help with my water pump. Original to the 2017 camper. Normally when my water tank is full and I flip the switch to turn on the water pump, you hear the pump start and charge the system. When the system is charged the pump stops and only turns on when I use the sink faucet. Currently the water pump does not stop and just keeps going and going. The faucet still works. I have detected no leaks despite trying hard to find one.

I just took the camper on a pretty epic White Rim adventure and simply had to use the pump switch to run water vs the faucet. We did not lose any water through the 4 days.

Is this just a bad pump that needs swapping, or do I need to consider other issues?

Thanks!!!
 

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Is your bottom valve below the water pump shut off? If not, faucet can be off but water will cycle through the open valve back into the storage tank. Worth checking.
 
You probably just have an air pocket. It happens to me when I let the tank run dry. After refilling the tank I may experience the problem you're having. I haven't researched a proper priming procedure I've just been opening sink faucets and/or the outdoor shower faucet to try and purge the air pocket until the pump stops cycling. I have a hot water heater and I think this makes priming harder also.
 
For BryanToyFWC's original issue, I echo Vic Harder's reply: Check out the Shur-Flo manual to adjust the pump resting pressure (i.e., so that the pump stops running when the faucet is closed). If water will flow through the faucet and there are no leaks, the pump itself is primed and fine, and just needs adjustment. I am rather ignorant of such things, but I believe there is a solenoid switch that is triggered by backpressure to shut the pump down when the faucet is closed, and if the screw that adjusts that solenoid isn't adjusted right, the pump keeps grinding away even when the faucet is closed.

Different but somewhat related problem: multiple times I've had trouble getting my pump to prime after I've emptied my tank, waterlines, and pump to winterize. In this case, of course, the pump grinds away but no water flows. I've found this works: Remove the filter on the pump (clear plastic cylinder next to the inlet on the pump [check that the filter is clean while you are at it]), squirt some water into the pump body [a pain in the b_tt]), fill the filter housing with water and re-install it. Sometimes I've had to do this a couple of times, so if anyone knows an easier way to prime these pumps I'd love to hear it.

Yet another different but somewhat related problem: Once I did everything stated in the previous paragraph. The pump ran on and on, but would not prime after two or three attempts to prime it. Finally I pulled the pump, took the housing off the top [eight screws], and found that the O-ring on the piston was a bit tweaked (probably by ice the previous winter). Fortunately it wasn't broken [I was in the middle of nowhere], so when I put the O-ring back in its groove on the piston and re-installed the pump it worked like a charm. Just a couple of hours gone when I would have rather been staring at rocks and trees...

I know the previous is TMI for the old timers and folks that know how to fix stuff, but nowadays FWC is selling a lot of campers to people that barely know the difference between a monkey wrench and and an allen wrench, and I gotta say owning one of these contraptions is an education!

Happy camping!
 
Great and informative post New Man!
I've never had the priming issues you mention. Your workarounds seem logical, given my experience with other pumps. I wonder if adjusting your pump might not solve this issue too?

There are two adjustments 1) Max Pressure and 2) Restart Pressure (my terms). I discovered this when I added a super high quality water filter to our camper. The filter restricted flow enough that it was now just a trickle coming out of the tap. I was going to buy a different water pump to compensate, and then figured out that I could adjust the pressure on my existing pump. I did that, and then had to adjust the "restart" pressure too so that it would run until max pressure was reached and not instantly restart when I turned on the tap, but wait a few moments instead. It took me a while of playing around with the settings to get it to run well. I keep the right sized allen key in a drawer in the camper in case it needs adjusting, but so far so good since I dialed it in last year.
 
New Man said:
<snip>
Different but somewhat related problem: multiple times I've had trouble getting my pump to prime after I've emptied my tank, waterlines, and pump to winterize. In this case, of course, the pump grinds away but no water flows. I've found this works: Remove the filter on the pump (clear plastic cylinder next to the inlet on the pump [check that the filter is clean while you are at it]), squirt some water into the pump body [a pain in the b_tt]), fill the filter housing with water and re-install it. Sometimes I've had to do this a couple of times, so if anyone knows an easier way to prime these pumps I'd love to hear it.

Yet another different but somewhat related problem: Once I did everything stated in the previous paragraph. The pump ran on and on, but would not prime after two or three attempts to prime it. Finally I pulled the pump, took the housing off the top [eight screws], and found that the O-ring on the piston was a bit tweaked (probably by ice the previous winter). Fortunately it wasn't broken [I was in the middle of nowhere], so when I put the O-ring back in its groove on the piston and re-installed the pump it worked like a charm. Just a couple of hours gone when I would have rather been staring at rocks and trees...

<snip>
The only times I’ve had priming issues was when all faucets were closed, once a faucet was opened, it primed without problem. I suspect the pump was compressing air in the lines which didn’t allow the pressure to build enough pressure to trigger sensing switch. YMMV
 
I went back and studied my Pentair "SHURFLO 4008 RV Revolution By-Pass Pump Installation & Operation Manual" p. 2 [who'da thunk to do that?]. It appears BryanToyFWC's original problem [THE PUMP WILL NOT SHUT OFF] and its fix is described there (as Vic Harder suggested):

"ABOUT THE BY-PASS



NOTE: By-pass adjustment should only be performed by a professional technician with proper gauges and equipment.
The by-pass is a spring loaded diaphragm that opens up allowing water from the discharge side back to the inlet side. The by-pass is set to begin opening at about 40 psi and creating full by-pass at about 62 psi (lower pressure pumps will vary depending on the by-pass and pressure shut-off settings). The pressure switch on the pump is set to shut off at 55 psi. If the switch or by-pass are adjusted too much, the by-pass and switch shut-off can overlap and THE PUMP WILL NOT SHUT OFF. Screwing the switch screw in clockwise will raise the shut-off pressure. Unscrewing the switch screw counterclockwise will lower the pump shut-off pressure. Screwing the by-pass screw in will raise the pressure at which the by-pass starts and raise the full by-pass pressure. Unscrewing the by-pass screw counterclockwise will lower the pressure at which by-pass starts and lower the full by-pass pressure.


WARNING: If full by-pass is reached before the shut-off setting, the pump will not shut off. Full by-pass pressure setting should be at least 10 psi higher than pump shut off pressure."

Also, p. 3:

"PUMP WILL NOT SHUT-OFF / RUNS WHEN FAUCET IS CLOSED



√ Output side (pressure) plumbing for leaks, and inspect for leaky valves or toilet.
√ For air trapped in outlet side (water heater) or pump head.
√ For correct voltage to pump (±10%). √ For loose drive assembly or pump
head screws.
√ Are the valves held open by debris

or is the rubber swollen?
√ Pressure switch operation. By-pass

set higher than shut-off."





Of course the manufacturer says to have the by-pass adjustment done by "a professional technician," but I'm guessing if one can decipher the manual and is careful one can pull it off without breaking one's water lines / frying the pump (see Vic Harder's post above). It strikes me as odd that a properly functioning pump could get "un-adjusted," but maybe bouncing around on really rough tracks can do it.

On my priming issue, it comes and goes. Note that I have the simplest of setups, just tank, pump, faucet [no water heater, shower, etc.]. Sometimes I fill the tank, turn on the pump [with the faucet open] and no problem. Other times the pump grinds on and on and won't prime. I have the notion that this occurs when I've done a super good job of winterizing so that there is no water to make an adequate seal around the O-ring on the piston in the pump. Then when I squirt water into the pump inlet and fill the filter housing it creates a vacuum seal that enables the pump to draw water up from the tank. Maybe.

I note FWC mentions priming as a possible issue in its helpful "Water Pump & Water System: Filling, Priming, Troublesooting Tips & Tricks" PDF:

"If you have not solved the problem yet, next try re-establishing a prime inside the water pump by somehow refilling the water line from the water pump, to the water tank, with water. Connect the water line again to the water pump and turn the pump back on to see if the water begins to move toward the faucets. This could take 10 or 20 seconds. Be sure the faucets are fully open (especially the cold water faucet) and watch to see if water starts coming out of the sink. Anything?"

For what it is worth, having fiddled around with my pump way more than I ever thought I would, I have the impression that these thing are pretty tough and rather simple devices, and not that hard to fix. If you've read this far, don't give up!

 
Thank you so much everyone!! I had to take the camper off the truck for some truck stuff, but will be back on soon and will start working through these solutions! I'll let you know what works. Thanks!!
 
I thought I had this issue solved last year, but has now resurfaced. I suspect an air pocket vs pump bypass adjustment as the issue resolved itself after a couple camping adventures. Camper was winterized/drained, and now back on the truck and the pump is endlessly running with the faucet on/off. Ugh. I had the hex key handy on our last adventure and played with the two adjustments per the instructions in one of the things above in an attempt to reset the pressures at both adjustments. No avail. Played with the adjustments as the pump ran, still no help. So maybe it is an air pocket or loose gasket somewhere in the pump? No leaks anywhere. Any hints at resolving air pockets other than just running the system continuously?

At this point I've been temped to just buy another pump as they aren't all that pricey, but suppose if it's some trapped air somewhere that wouldn't solve the issue......
 
As New Man pointed out, these are tough little units, and fully serviceable. I suspect the occasional pump may have the springs that those screws adjust stretch or lose strength, and then start to run continuously.

When adjusting the pressure, don't be afraid to let the pump run until you get it right. I run my pump to winterize the camper, and I have also emptied the whole 30gal water tank 3-4 times to get rid of RV antifreezde taste (never using that stuff again!), so the pump can run a LOOOONG time without damage.

Other WtW folks have reported good luck in taking the pump portion apart, and have found small grains of dirt/sand that prevent a seal. No seal, no pumping. I wonder if taking the pump apart and applying a food grade silicone to the ring/gasket would help?
 
Are you getting full flow out of the faucet? One spring when I went to de-winterize my pump was acting all weird on me. Went through a bunch of trouble shooting which included completely taking it apart and reassembling, and no luck. Was also considering buying a new pump. The problem actually ended up being at the faucet aerator. It was PACKED with sediment, likely from the hot water heater which i hadn't sprayed out in a while. Once I cleaned that out it was back to normal.
 
Thanks everyone!! I actually just stopped by the new FWC dealer in Colorado. Nice guys. They took a look and recommended a new pump. Looks very easy to install on my own, so have ordered one. If anyone wants an 2017 pump to play with, let me know!!

The faucet worked great. To Vic, I did fuss with the adjustments while running and running the pump and was not able to get it to stop when the faucet was closed. The dealer also checked everything for leaks and there weren't any in the entire system.
 
BryanToyFWC said:
Thanks everyone!! I actually just stopped by the new FWC dealer in Colorado. Nice guys. They took a look and recommended a new pump. Looks very easy to install on my own, so have ordered one. If anyone wants an 2017 pump to play with, let me know!!

The faucet worked great. To Vic, I did fuss with the adjustments while running and running the pump and was not able to get it to stop when the faucet was closed. The dealer also checked everything for leaks and there weren't any in the entire system.
Hmmm. Well, if the pump was defective, then adjusting it would not likely help. Let us know how it goes!
 
I'm having a similar problem with my Shurflo pump M/N 4009-101-A32 in a 2014 Hawk. It runs, spits a little water out of the faucet and then nothing. I checked the lines for leaks with a hand vacuum pump and all are good. I removed and disassembled the pump and found a stuck check valve. Unstuck the valve, reassembled and reinstalled - same thing! No flow.

I'm wondering if the valve body was damaged after running with a stuck check valve. So, I've ordered a new valve body and check valve from Amazon - total cost about $50, almost as much as a new pump. Will report back when I've received and installed the new parts.
 
Last week I did a quick trip to the desert to take advantage of a nice day. I hadn't yet filled my water tank in my 2017 Grandby, so I filled it about 3/4 full (I could have done less since it was just an overnight). I was in a hurry because I wanted to get going and it was a 100 mile drive.

When I arrived at camp I popped the top and made dinner. I used only the cold water and the pump worked just fine but it wouldn't shut off, I had to use the switch. I remembered that I hadn't filled the hot water heater, as well as the lines for the indoor and outdoor shower. I still haven't done that, but I expect that when I do, the shutoff on the water will work as it is supposed to. I still haven't done that as it has been cool and rainy lately, but I will try to get it done tomorrow. I'll let you know what happens. The whole system needs to be charged with water for the shutoff to work.
 
Today I replaced the valve assembly ($27 from Amazon) and the check valve ($18 from Amazon) today and the pump now works great, better flow than I've seen recently. Not sure which part was the problem but I suspect it was the check valve as I found it stuck closed on initial disassembly. All the o-rings looked a bit deteriorated so good to replace those as well. I hope to get another 10 years of service out of it.

All the parts were genuine Shurflo and included detailed instructions. It seems Shureflo has a sense of humor as the instructions included the following comment:

Although switch and by-pass adjustment are not recommended, we know you RVer's can't leave anything untouched or understood, so here is the way it works...

It then goes on to explain the workings of the by-pass and pressure switches.
 
It took me a couple of days to get to it but today I discovered that my low point water valve was in fact in the wrong position, it was parallel the drain pipe. I turned it to be 90 degrees the pipe and opened the hot water faucet and was able to fill the water heater until I had a steady stream flowing from the tap. I then shut it off and it immediately shut the pump off. All is working as it should and I learned to not try to do things by memory but actually read the instructions.
 
camper rich said:
It took me a couple of days to get to it but today I discovered that my low point water valve was in fact in the wrong position, it was parallel the drain pipe. I turned it to be 90 degrees the pipe and opened the hot water faucet and was able to fill the water heater until I had a steady stream flowing from the tap. I then shut it off and it immediately shut the pump off. All is working as it should and I learned to not try to do things by memory but actually read the instructions.
I recommend making a photo copy of the water system valve settings for bypass, winterized, and normal configurations, and keeping stored it in a ziplock that is close to the valves.
 
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