24 replies to this topic

[erod]

Thanks Stan... that's great. So is system for ATC about the same?? Maybe I have to ask that in the other forum. Also curious about the fabric as it goes up and down, it must want to blow out as the lid collapses... how do you keep it in while holding on to the lid and brace at the same time??? Shock cords?

I liked your tour of the show area... informative and encouraging!

len, there are cords you attach that pull the fabric in, works great...where have you been ?

[benburnett]

Len,

The ATC has the same roof lift system. On the inside flaps of the liner there are a set of D rings attached in both front and back. When you lower the top you hook a shock cord to these rings from side to side in the front and the back and that pulls the liner in for you when you lower the top.

You still have to go outside and push in the corners of the liner as you latch the top down. Everyone should do this. If you push in the corners every time you will not get the wear spots that are so common on the corners of the liner.

[WarpathEngineering]

Ben,

While we are on the subject of the lift mechanism, do you know where I can find replacement hinges? I called FWC and talked to Chicali but he said that the hinges are not available by themselves. Does ATC or anyone you know sell the hinges by themselves?

Rick

[benburnett]

Give me a call when you get a chance. I'll sell you as many hinges as you want.

[Len]

Ok... I get it. The downside (from my unknowledgeable perspective) of the lift system at ATC and WTC is that the solid ends mean no end windows are possible. I would think especially in the door end, a window would be nice, as the door is kind of low. Well ya can't have everything**, but it does get the designer in me thinking. Our tent trailer has the coolest fabric support system over the beds. So light and simple. Kind of a hoop pushed up in place with a bent aluminum rod that then props into a hook in the ceiling. I'm sure you've all seen them. With the pop up campers you need some leverage advantage someplace. Plus of course something solid for the roof to stand on.

Windows seem to me to be pretty important in a small pop up camper... during the day, we like openness to the outside world... to feel like we are part of it. At night, being in a small space feels nice.

** I just learned today why a side to side lift system aint' so great... pushes out the walls.

[benburnett]

There are four rather large windows around the top of the camper. More than enough for a good breeze to come through when they are open. Also lets lots of light into the camper if you have them open during the day.

Now for the reality of camping.

When I have been camping I don't remember one time that I had the windows on the camper open. I know I am probably an odd one in this but during the day, I am out doing what I went camping for. I come back in the evening and usually sit around chatting with friends and by the time I get back into the camper it is dark and I have no reason to open any windows.

The ultimate camper for me would not have a window in it. Of course I am a guy and could live in a cave and be happy. As long as it had a TV, frig, sofa and a tree close by.

Between the four windows in the liner, the large side window and the back door, there is a lot of window space in the camper. There is also the option of putting another window in the back if one wants too.

I have seen campers with different lift systems in them that allow for a window up front and one in back. I can also buy those campers today, used for about 500.00 all day long because of the shape that they are in.

Pretty much it is a give and take on getting the longevity vs the creature comforts that some others offer.

It all comes down to being just a matter of what you want a camper for and how you plan to use it. There are a lot of manufacturers out there and they all build something a little different from the other ones because of consumer demand. If we build it, someone will want it somewhere.

We can't please everyone all the time. So instead we try to cater to a very select group of consumers that we can please and will recommend us to others for the style of camping that they do.

[Len]

I'm a fan of openning all the windows in our tent trailer on a nice day and laying on the bed reading. In our old truck camper, I liked to pull of the road at a nice viewpoint, stretch out for a bit and enjoy the view. After a day of hiking it's nice to stretch out in the sun for a nap. I laid awake last night thinking of roof lift systems... it's a chronic disease inherited from my father. We used to build tent trailers when I was a kid (just for ourselves) the first one was AWFUL!! The last one, if we had patented the design, might have made us some money. The Otto tent trailer company began using the same idea shortly after. You pulled out the beds and the soft top camper roof came open like an accordian, then you went in the trailer, popped up the center support and that was it. We crossed this country with that beast. So pay no mind you serious manufacturers, just the ramblings of a demented amateur inventor.

[winter200]

I don't understand why a guy couldn't come up with a different system for opening and supporting the camper compared to the system that is there now. After seeing how bad the wood can get over time I have been thinking about this also. The system thats out there works good but I think there should be more ways to accomplish the same thing and clean up the back end. I would imagine that the reason for the full width lift system is to spread out the wieght on the rear wall.

[Len]

I would imagine that the reason for the full width lift system is to spread out the wieght on the rear wall.

I don't own a 4WC or ATC (yet) so I'm just trying to assess from pictures how it works and how it's constructed. The weight, I think is entirely supported by the two narrow ends of the roof, isn't that right? Are the two panels (front and rear) different in any way?

[WarpathEngineering]

Len,

Your not alone with your questions. When I was looking for my FWC I was totally confused as to how the thing opened. A guy here on the forum sent me these pictures. Sorry, I cannot remember who sent them but for me they helped a lot! Both the front and the back lifting panels are the same except the one over the overhang has an assist handle. Each lift panel is constructed with 2 pieces of what I'll call 1/8" plywood, one panel being larger than the other, and 3 spring loaded piano or continuous hinges. The upper panel is attached to the top with one hinge and to the MIDDLE of the lower panel by another. The lower panel, which is the larger and overlaps the upper panel by about half the width is attached at the camper frame with the third hinge. The extra length of the bottom panel provides mechanical advantage when lifting. Hope this helps!

Winter200,

I'm in the process of re-engineering my lifting mechanism and I'll post photos if and when I get done or more to the point if they work at all. I'm not trying to re-event the wheel here and I know that FWC and ATC are very proud of their lifting mechanism. From what I've read, they consider this simple mechanism one of the hallmarks of the camper. I was left with shreaded wheat when I bought mine and my primary concern with having the solid panels front and rear is the mold groth behind the panels and on the liner (we're talking science fair here!). I know that we all need to air out the camper once and a while, a chore that the previous owner didn't think important but I have a certain comfort level to having access to that hidden area. I guess it's the maintenance man in me.

Rick

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